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Thread: Internal Iron Shirt

  1. #1
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    Internal Iron Shirt

    Kuo Yu Chang (Gu Ruzhang) & Iron Shirt

    First Demonstration of Kuo Yu Chang in 1925, Kuo Yu Chang's Iron Palm and Iron Shirt abilities were witnessed by a certain Hwang Hsien Sheng. To summarize the story, a Russian circus had posted an open challenge to anyone who would dare take three kicks from one of their horses. Anyone who survived would receive $1000 in gold, a huge sum of money at that time. Kuo Yu Chang accepted the challenge under one condition; instead of money, Kuo asked to strike the horse with one slap of his palm. The Russian owners of the circus accepted his conditions. In front of a huge crowd, the horse raised his hind leg and kicked Kuo in the chest. The crowd was silent in disbelief. Kuo then gathered his strength and when the horse kicked Kuo a second time, the crowd roared. When the horse kicked Kuo a third time, the crowd gave Kuo a huge ovation. Kuo then rested for more than half an hour. When he returned, he struck the horse in the rear, and the horse fell dead. Again, the crowd cheered at this incredible feat.

    There are a number of methods for taking a blow:

    1.flexing the muscles of the area to be hit,
    2.twisting the area targeted to deflect the martial trajectory and penetration,
    3.yielding to the blow and being moved back, and
    4.using Chi in absorbing the strike (Cotton Belly) or resonating with it (Golden Bell).

    The only method I have used and seen to protect oneself from multiple blows, from multiple directions, seen or not; is Internal Iron Shirt.

    I have gone to Karate Schools, boxers, warehouseman, and weight lifters to let them try my internal Iron Shirt here in Juneau, Alaska. I will let them do flurries, but keep it confined to my stomach and abdominal area, kick and/or punches. Sometimes they miss and I have taken it in Solar Plexus without harm, by mistake.

    I do not deflect, block or move, but might get forced backward as I absorbed the blow. In California I would get knocked across the room with Tae Kwon Do abominal kicks without injury, and with current conditioning, no bruises.

    Only the internal methods Iron Shirt (Cotton Belly and Golden Bell) are effective passively, with multiple strikes from different angles to different areas of the body!

    Internal Iron Shirt, Cotton Belly and Golden Bell

    It is usually easier to flow Chi (Qi) through healthy muscle tissue, so weight training is used; not to build muscle bulk, but to tone the tissue. This type of training is not classical weight training in that the push is started in the Lower Dan Tien and moves to the arm or leg muscle. Normally, for most people, the only emphasis is in the contraction of only the immediate muscle between the joint that is moving.

    Strenuous exercise is complimented with the stretches so as to minimize the effects of over pumping and stiff rigid muscles. This integrates full body movement and energies so the body can respond flowingly and evenly to transmit combined power of all the parts involved.

    Internal energy can be developed in many methods. For preliminary internal toning of the abdominal area and internal organ area of the body, one may use hundreds of pushups, sit-ups and meditation; to bring the Qi flow to a high enough level to proceed to higher levels of Qi Gong, Internal Iron Shirt and Internal Iron Palm. Others methods attain a strong internal energy flow through months doing Grand or Small Circulation Qi Gong or Iron Shirt Qi Gong Massage and beating.

    Before studying martial arts, as a young man, Grandmaster Joe Greenstein once was shot between the eyes with a .38 - .40 caliber revolver by a man jealous of his wife. He walked out of the hospital the same day. Joe became very interested in the powers of the mind, since he survived this shot at the ‘third eye’ used in Buddhist meditation.

    Martial meditation can bring the body’s internal energy to a high level, so a basic background in meditation is presented along with specific martial consciousness concepts.

    MARSHMALLOW GUT (COTTON BELLY)

    WANG SHU-CHIN

    A student of the famed Chang Chao-tung on the mainland, Wang's Hsing-i and Pa-kua were orthodox, and machined to perfection. With his bulk, hands the size of small rosebushes, and his surprising speed, the goal of Hsing-i-to occupy the enemies territory-was adroitly done. The internal system stresses the cultivation of chi, deep breathing, and a drastically different approach to the mechanical aspects of fighting ... . like Shao-lin it has many advocates who can withstand with impunity a foot or fist to the midriff. Wang not only has this skill, but can actually use his vast stomach against one's fist on impact so as to produce a broken wrist. Throughout Asia he has been tested , and no one comes close to hurting him. Leading Japanese karate masters have bowed to him after failing on his punch.

    But this alone cannot make a fighter. Frank "Cannonball" Richards, the carnival performer, and various other "marshmallow gut" types in the United States have the capability to take a stomach attack. Indeed, Harry Houdini died as a result of his inability with this feat. After ineffectually Wang's belly once, I asked if he could take a solar plexus strike. "Try it," he said. I did-several times, with no effect. But beyond this special skill Wang could do something beyond the ability of all the fighters I saw. He could take any kick to the lower extremities(excluding, of course the groin). I kicked him repeatedly on his knee, calf, and ankle until my feet ached, all with no effect.

    " How do you do it?" I asked.
    His answer: "Chi."

    Such skills do not connote anything more than defensive ability. Coupled in Wang, these skills left an attacker only two targets, the head and groin, both very mobile and difficult to hit. But one still might properly ask, could he fight?

    He could and did. He has spent much of his time in recent years in Japan and has fought several high-ranking karate men. No one has come close to defeating this seventy-year-old warrior. In the process he has come to a supreme depreciation of karate. He feels that the original forms borrowed from China have been distorted and that the nonsensical high kicks and vigorous body hardening avail nothing when confronted with real technique.

    And technique he has. He uses Hsing-i fist with a corkscrew twist from one inch out with more effect than most men get form a full-stance strike. John Bluming, Dutch amateur judo champion and Mas Oyama's prize foreign karateka, even though he had hurt his wrist on Wang's stomach, disparaged him to me once when I was visiting Tokyo. "What else can he do?" asked John. I took John to Wang and asked that he be shown the corkscrew, but to keep it gentle. Wang put his relaxed fingers on Bluming's stomach, curled them into a fist and screwed. Bluming bent over in agony and has since been a believer.

    Chinese Boxing, Masters and Methods, by Robert W. Smith, pages 72-74, published by North Atlantic Books, Berkeley, CA, 1974, 1990

    CANNONBALL RICHARDS

    Footage of Cannonball Richards showed the enormous man take a cannonball right in his mighty abdominals, only staggering back a foot or two, followed by a piece called “Edge” in which STREB performers whammed themselves frontally against a wall of Plexiglas placed between them and the audience

    Above from: Seattle Union Record

    I have demonstrated Cotton Belly to many karate schools, weight lifters and boxers in California and Alaska, and no one can hurt my abdominal area with any combination of blows or kicks.

    Good demonstration at about 3 minutes into the video Shaolin Kung Fu child & Iron Shirt Demo Jin Zhong Zhao.

    This is genuine, it is unique in that:
    1) he does not move,
    2) he does not deflect,
    3) he does not have a thin layer of kevlar under his shirt,(no shirt),
    4) blows taken are powerful, and
    5) HE TAKES MULTIPLE BLOWS FROM MULTIPLE ANGLES & DIRECTIONS
    SIMULTANEOUSLY!

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3Gfq5UEus6k
    Last edited by Foiling Fist; 09-15-2011 at 05:59 PM.

  2. #2
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    mythology is great, i enjoy reading about it as well.

    seriously though....

    even taking this into consideration, which is a big stretch for me, why do this?

    first off why not just step out of the way? someone attacks don't stand in front of the train coming, move. I understand you have to condition to take a hits but honestly most people (common) don't strike to the abs, they go for the head. and taking into consideration your above statements there is no conditioning for taking one to the head.

    not trying to be rude to you, glad you enjoy what you do, but the reality of it is not practical.
    Originally posted by Bawang
    i had an old taichi lady talk smack behind my back. i mean comon man, come on. if it was 200 years ago,, mebbe i wouldve smacked her and took all her monehs.
    Originally posted by Bawang
    i am manly and strong. do not insult me cracker.

  3. #3
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    I suspect most pro heavyweight MMA fighters have Iron body skills on par with that shaolin Monk.

    FF:

    I suggest you make a bet with the world: challenge anyone with a horse that you can take 3 kicks from it; if you remain unscathed, they owe you $2500. If not, then you owe them the same amount. Then, palm strike the horses ass. If it dies, they owe you another $2500. If it doesn't, you owe them that amount.

    Make sure you get it on video, too.


    Hey, if this guy made a $5000 bet, then your challenge should be worth at least that much, no?
    "It is the peculiar quality of a fool to perceive the faults of others and to forget his own." -Cicero

  4. #4
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    it never happened.

    gu accepted and the other guy apologized, nothing actually happened.

    Honorary African American
    grandmaster instructor of Wombat Combat The Lost Art of Anal Destruction™®LLC .
    Senior Business Director at TEAM ASSHAMMER consulting services ™®LLC

  5. #5
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    There is nothing internal about taking a shot, people do it all the time.
    Taking shots when NOT expecting them IN a fight, that is a different story.
    Hard to direct your chi when you are getting punched in the face
    Psalms 144:1
    Praise be my Lord my Rock,
    He trains my hands for war, my fingers for battle !

  6. #6
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    Iron body/shirt/vest affords the protection and conditioning that is offered elsewhere. There is nothing mystical or magical about it.

    It is slow process body conditioning through breath work, compression techniques, contraction methods and being struck with various things all over the upper body.

    A western boxer attains the same conditioning with medicine ball drops, his regular conditioning, sparring and core work.

    the mysticism can be removed from most things. I find it quite funny these days that people get all wide eyed and misty about these things.

    It is very practical work. requires effort and ability to withstand some pain.
    Teaches you that getting hitting isn't that bad and that you are stronger than you think you are. IN a basic sense of it. With continued efforts, your body becomes reasonably hardened and conditioned to the point where you can easily shrug off strikes to your body.

    Your head? You need to train how to roll with punches, how to shrimp it, how to destroy incoming and how to kill energy by stepping in. It's a whole different set of skills and abilities protecting the head and learning the physics of hitting and being hit.

    In the end, you can still be knocked out in one go 20 seconds into your fight. That's how it goes.
    Kung Fu is good for you.

  7. #7
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    Quote Originally Posted by David Jamieson View Post
    Iron body/shirt/vest affords the protection and conditioning that is offered elsewhere. There is nothing mystical or magical about it.

    It is slow process body conditioning through breath work, compression techniques, contraction methods and being struck with various things all over the upper body.

    A western boxer attains the same conditioning with medicine ball drops, his regular conditioning, sparring and core work.

    the mysticism can be removed from most things. I find it quite funny these days that people get all wide eyed and misty about these things.

    It is very practical work. requires effort and ability to withstand some pain.
    Teaches you that getting hitting isn't that bad and that you are stronger than you think you are. IN a basic sense of it. With continued efforts, your body becomes reasonably hardened and conditioned to the point where you can easily shrug off strikes to your body.

    Your head? You need to train how to roll with punches, how to shrimp it, how to destroy incoming and how to kill energy by stepping in. It's a whole different set of skills and abilities protecting the head and learning the physics of hitting and being hit.

    In the end, you can still be knocked out in one go 20 seconds into your fight. That's how it goes.
    DJ has potato sacked the correct !
    Psalms 144:1
    Praise be my Lord my Rock,
    He trains my hands for war, my fingers for battle !

  8. #8
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    Show me an "internal iron shirt" guy who:

    1) isn't flexing at the moment of impact (blindfold him so he doesn't know when the strike is coming and doesn't flex)

    2) isn't fat (why is it always fat guys taking the punches to the abdomen during demos? Fat provides extra protection and disperses energy)

    3) isn't using some physics or leverage trick

    and I will be a believer.

    And just to clarify, being able to take a hard blow to the body without pain or injury is an impressive skill. Most people cannot do it. I don't understand why people can't just admit that they are doing it because they are flexing their muscles or whatever rather than having to blame it on some mystical power. I think it's an ego thing.
    "If you like metal you're my friend" -- Manowar

    "I am the cosmic storms, I am the tiny worms" -- Dimmu Borgir

    <BombScare> i beat the internet
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  9. #9
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    Quote Originally Posted by IronFist View Post
    I think it's an ego thing.
    I think it's getting a result from a method without clearly understanding teh machinations of just how that method worked.

    It's ignorance that postulates myth upon a method and result of it.

    as knowledge is gained, the method is regarded as causality and the result is effect and in the end the process becomes intellectually observable and understood.
    Kung Fu is good for you.

  10. #10
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    True. There are some people who believe that they are using qi rather than body mechanics and physics.

    The blind leading the blind.
    "If you like metal you're my friend" -- Manowar

    "I am the cosmic storms, I am the tiny worms" -- Dimmu Borgir

    <BombScare> i beat the internet
    <BombScare> the end guy is hard.

  11. #11
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    Quote Originally Posted by IronFist View Post

    The blind leading the blind.
    To a lesser extent. Yeah, but I don't think that was a primary consequence.

    They were achieving results suitable to their purpose and in context to whatever combat they were involved with. With the golden bell, KYC was a soldier in the KMT and also was involved in competitions and demonstrations and such. An interesting Kung Fu man in the timeline for sure.

    H2H Fighting was of some interest to him and the methods he used were shaolin and other arts.
    Kung Fu is good for you.

  12. #12
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    Qi Education

    Qi's effect has been proven; martially and in scientific tests.

    When someone does not know something, it is ignorance; once they have been instructed and continue with the mistake; it is no longer ignorance, but stupidity.

    For a Western Scientific explanation of Qi(Chi) using the Piezoelectric Effect, see:
    http://martial.securesites.net/forum...77#post1133977

    For clinical studies if emitted Qi, done at numerous hospitals; in China and Japan, see: http://jadedragonalaska.yolasite.com...asurements.php

    Quote Originally Posted by IronFist View Post
    True. There are some people who believe that they are using qi rather than body mechanics and physics.

    The blind leading the blind.
    Regarding: 'why people can't just admit that they are doing it because they are flexing their muscles '

    Flexed muscles are rigid, pumped and unyielding. When Qi is used to take a blow, the area is not tense, nor does it move. I have done this blindfolded for years. I will show the differencde between the two and use muscles once; to contrast the difference. Everyone whohas tried it feels the difference.

    For those wanting proof, show up in person; you can not do this through a computer.

    Not everyone suffers fools gladly, so you might have to ask politely, know a friend, or pay for the privelage.

    If you are a principled skeptic, and want to find out for yourself; testing procedures are detailed at:
    http://martial.securesites.net/forum...81#post1133981
    Last edited by Foiling Fist; 09-19-2011 at 04:39 PM.

  13. #13
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    One good turn deserves another

    It appears that you were already kicked in the head.

    Quote Originally Posted by Xiao3 Meng4 View Post
    I suspect most pro heavyweight MMA fighters have Iron body skills on par with that shaolin Monk.

    FF:

    I suggest you make a bet with the world: challenge anyone with a horse that you can take 3 kicks from it; if you remain unscathed, they owe you $2500. If not, then you owe them the same amount. Then, palm strike the horses ass. If it dies, they owe you another $2500. If it doesn't, you owe them that amount.

    Make sure you get it on video, too.


    Hey, if this guy made a $5000 bet, then your challenge should be worth at least that much, no?

  14. #14
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    Luckily, my Qi powers deflected the blow to Alaska.

    I apologize for the further damage it caused to your already limited reasoning capabilities.

    But hey, you seem happy enough to pontificate about your delusions all over the Internet in an attempt to sell your brand of crazy, so no harm done, really.

    Not everyone suffers fools gladly, so you might have to ... pay for the privelage.
    lolz.
    "It is the peculiar quality of a fool to perceive the faults of others and to forget his own." -Cicero

  15. #15
    Quote Originally Posted by Foiling Fist View Post
    Qi's effect has been proven; martially
    oh, really?!? I'd say that the evidence of using qi in a martial setting DISPROVES it completely (at least in terms of the limited perspective that you and other MA-ists have of it)
    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ar1yXYOsxQk
    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gEDaC...eature=related

    Quote Originally Posted by Foiling Fist View Post
    and in scientific tests.
    no, it has not; none of the studies you cite "prove" qi - they only demonstrate the ability of certain individuals to consciously manipulate things like body heat and eectromagnetic field; nothing about "qi" per se - u can't measure a known entity like heat and use those results to demonstrate something that is a metaphorical construct;

    Quote Originally Posted by Foiling Fist View Post
    When someone does not know something, it is ignorance; once they have been instructed and continue with the mistake; it is no longer ignorance, but stupidity.
    you don't have to underscore this, we acknowledge this about you, and accept it;

    Quote Originally Posted by Foiling Fist View Post
    For a Western Scientific explanation of Qi(Chi) using the Piezoelectric Effect, see:
    http://martial.securesites.net/forum...77#post1133977
    um, sorry - this is not an explanation of qi, it's an explanation of the pizoelectric effect in the body, with the attempt to retrofit this knowledge into the "qi" paradigm; that's not scientific at all;

    Quote Originally Posted by Foiling Fist View Post
    For clinical studies if emitted Qi, done at numerous hospitals; in China and Japan, see: http://jadedragonalaska.yolasite.com...asurements.php
    look, you can't just post little snippets of studies and expect anyone to take it seriously - you need to read the actual studies; especially because, typically, studies of these nature that come out of China are riddled with methodological errors that all but obviate any of the results that they publish;


    Quote Originally Posted by Foiling Fist View Post
    Regarding: 'why people can't just admit that they are doing it because they are flexing their muscles '
    Flexed muscles are rigid, pumped and unyielding.
    no, they are not - a contracting muscle is only rigid if you have two opposing muscles (agonist / antagonist group) contracting at the same time; otherwise, when a muscle contract, it <gasp> moves! (which would kinda be the opposite of rigid and unyielding)

    Quote Originally Posted by Foiling Fist View Post
    When Qi is used to take a blow, the area is not tense, nor does it move. I have done this blindfolded for years. I will show the differencde between the two and use muscles once; to contrast the difference. Everyone whohas tried it feels the difference.
    sure, because they are uneducated about anatomy, physiology, biomechanics, physics, etc. and just take your word for it bec u can take a blow to an area without isometrically contracting the musculature there; boy, yeah, that really makes u an authority on, well, everything, i guess...

    Quote Originally Posted by Foiling Fist View Post
    For those wanting proof, show up in person;
    yes, we wil all drop everything and run up to Alaska

    Quote Originally Posted by Foiling Fist View Post
    you can not do this through a computer.
    yet apparently that is exactly what you are attempting to accomplish - "prove" your point via computer;

    Quote Originally Posted by Foiling Fist View Post
    Not everyone suffers fools gladly, so you might have to ask politely, know a friend, or pay for the privelage.
    now u r just babbling

    Quote Originally Posted by Foiling Fist View Post
    If you are a principled skeptic, and want to find out for yourself; testing procedures are detailed at:
    http://martial.securesites.net/forum...81#post1133981
    these studies don't "prove" qi; what the demonstrate, assuming that they r even valid and reliable, is that so-called qigong "masters" are able to atypically influence things such as heat, electromagnetic fields, etc.; and that's fine, it's not impossible, not even improbable; but it doesn't prove "qi" to exist as a discreet energy / force - and that's because QI IS A METAPHOR - it is a conceptual apparatus within which is contained things like heat, pressure, electromagnetism, bioelectrical fields, etc. - because the ancient Chinese looked at a whole panel of different phenomena and based on their amalgam of various factors talked about someone's "qi" - if you knew ANYTHING about TCM, u wud realize that "qi" is not one "thing", it is a descriptor for the integrated function of the human organism - really, go read "Web That Has No Weaver" by Kaptchuk, for example, to get a true understanding of what "qi" encompasses;

    you r so invested in ur own dilettantism, u can't even understand the glaring flaws in ur reasoning;

    but here's the funny thing: you are probably one of those people that trumpet up and down how so-called "western science" cannot adequately describe "qi", that it is something beyond the ability of western science to encompass; if a valid and reliable study comes out that discounts the existence of "qi" (usually a double blind randomized study that demonstrates placebo effect or some such), u simply say that science is no good for studying "qi"; yet, you will, without missing a beat, tout studies that come out in favor of ur belief system (without paying any attention to the foundational methodological flaws that they typically contain); in other words, you want it both ways: western science is no good when it doesn't support ur perspective, but when it does, now we have "scientific" proofs; it's always the same story with your type, sad to say, and u just. don't. get. it.

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